Congratulations Kosova!
by Will, 17 February 2008
“From today onwards, Kosovo is proud, independent and free,” said Thaci, a former leader of the Kosovo Liberation Army, which battled Serbian troops in a 1998-99 separatist war that claimed 10,000 lives. “We never lost faith in the dream that one day we would stand among the free nations of the world, and today we do.”
“Our hopes have never been higher,” he told the assembly. “Dreams are infinite, our challenges loom large, but nothing can deter us from moving forward to the greatness that history has reserved for us.”
The G_d squad and usual clerical fascist filth aren’t best pleased mind you:
Serb church urges state of war over Kosovo
Bishop Artemije:
“Serbia should buy state of the art weapons from Russia and other countries and call on Russia to send the volunteers and establish a military presence in Serbia,”
“Kosovo was and always will be Serbian,” the bishop said. The declaration of independence that its Albanian leaders are due to make later on Sunday means “a temporary state of occupation”.
“Everything will pass, and so will the occupation of Kosovo,” the 73-year-old church leader added.
Awww shut the fuck up you stupid owld retarded fuck!
Sunday 17 February 2008 at 17:23
“The G_d squad and usual clerical fascist filth aren’t best pleased mind you:”
Me neither.
Any news from the Gypsies, Serbs and Jews this psychotic, pogrom-throwing, supremacist rabble have already ethnically cleansed?
http://www.hrw.org/reports/2004/kosovo0704/7.htm
Sunday 17 February 2008 at 17:27
I would have been against Spanish Fascists in the ’30s. This would not have made Spanish Stalinists any better.
Sunday 17 February 2008 at 19:20
I’d like to join Will in offering my congratulations.
Scratch has a phony concern for human rights. Yes, there are some serious fears about how ethnic minorities will be treated in an independent Kosovo, and Thaci absolutely has to be held to his stated commitment to protecting ethnic minorities in the state. Yet while Scratch, and the many others like him, will talk about how awful and brutal this “psychotic, pogrom-throwing, supremacist rabble” are, with the implied logical conclusion that Kosovo should not be an independent state, you hear nary a word either about the mass killings, mass rapes, and mass expulsions of Kosovar Albanians during the war in the late 90s. You will never hear from Scratch about how Kosovars struggling to have Kosovo’s status upgraded from an autonomous province to a full federal republic in Yugoslavia were repressed, imprisoned, and killed. This isn’t to weigh grievance against grievance, it’s to point out how employing human rights to argue for or against independence simply doesn’t work. Over 90% of Kosovo’s population wanted formal independence, and, if you have respect whatsoever for the idea of self-determination, that should be good enough for all of us.
Sunday 17 February 2008 at 19:29
Yes, congratulations to the Kosovars on becoming independent of Serbia. It’s what they want.
Being an EU protectorate is not full independence, but it is probably the best solution in the circumstances. Let’s hope that Kosovo’s democracy beds down quickly, and a new generation of political leaders emerges which is not contaminated with psychopathic killers and organised criminals.
Sunday 17 February 2008 at 19:36
Hang on, isn’t the EU’s unilateral and illegal support for Kosovo independence not of concern? This is EU neo-liberal imperialism!
Sunday 17 February 2008 at 20:28
“Scratch has a phony concern for human rights.”
Graeme has nothing but contempt for the human rights of Gypsies, Jews and Serbs. Easy this attributing unworthy motives to you interlocutor business isn’t it?
“Yes, there are some serious fears about how ethnic minorities will be treated in an independent Kosovo,”
That’s unsurprising seeing how ethnic minorities were offed at will under the UN protectorate.
“…and Thaci absolutely has to be held to his stated commitment to protecting ethnic minorities in the state.”
Agreed, one would hate to see the ruthless punishment the Croatians suffered after the ethnic cleansing of the Dalmatian and Krajina Serbs visited upon this newest of European states.
“…Blah de blah de blah…This isn’t to weigh grievance against grievance,”
Yes it is.
” it’s to point out how employing human rights to argue for or against independence simply doesn’t work.”
Presumably once Tibet is rammed to the gills with a majority of imported Chinese, as is happening now, the Tibetans are fair game and their right to statehood is forever invalid then?
Not that I’m suggesting that Kosovan Albanians were/weren’t ever relocated in this manner, no point in lying about it, I don’t know.
” Over 90% of Kosovo’s population wanted formal independence, and, if you have respect whatsoever for the idea of self-determination, that should be good enough for all of us.”
The Kosovans can have statehood if they want as far as I’m concerned, so can the Croats, Montenegrans, Slovenians and the various bits of Bosnia. I’ve no particular interest in the whereabouts of Balkan borders… but I’ll be fucked if I’m going to be best pleased with hundreds of thousands of people being thrown to the wolves in states being founded by murderous, racist vermin like Thraci.
I’ll say this for Serbia in the sure and certain knowledge that I’ll get flamed to fuck for it…minorities, including Albanians can walk around that joint without fear of being murdered by fascists, patently not so in Kosovo.
That’s why, at this point in time, I oppose it.
Feel free to come back in a couple of years and say “I told you so” if minorities in Kosovo are the flourishing happy band you appear to presume they will be though, I’ll admit I was wrong, I’m like that.
Sunday 17 February 2008 at 21:22
[this comment was by Benjy of the HP Sauce fame — die slowly you vermin]
Sunday 17 February 2008 at 21:46
Good. The KLA has been cursed by getting everything they wished for.
Sunday 17 February 2008 at 21:59
[racist filth — now deleted — ignorant tosser]
Sunday 17 February 2008 at 22:14
Is Harry’s Place down this evening?
Sunday 17 February 2008 at 22:24
I was just about to ask the same thing.
Reet — back to my DVD watching.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 1:50
“Serbia should buy state of the art weapons from Russia and other countries and call on Russia to send the volunteers and establish a military presence in Serbia,”
Sounds like a right laugh, this Bishop. I can’t imagine Rowan Williams saying something similar if Alex Salmond ever got out of hand up north.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 2:02
Jimbo joins in the celebrations.
A very good lad. Worth a kiss he is.
http://shirazsocialist.wordpress.com/2008/02/18/congratulations-kosova/
‘Tis also funny to see HP Saucers align themselves with pretend ‘Trotskyists’ on the question of nations and their right to self-determination. That is — they agree with each other — what filth — what scum they are — put them in camps. What a crowd of scum. Delete the swamp.
PS. I have no intent of acting as a constant gadfly regarding cunts and their efforts to explicate the Serb fascists or to distract from this general train of discussion, but I will inject some remarks from time to time that may add to the discussion, and of course react to reactions to me.
Denying authority to those who make macro-social judgments based upon moralism and its offshoots, while they know so little of the forms that produce said social agglomerates themselves, or their social background, for that matter, and whose general cultural mindset is not to be trusted. Well — they can fuck off in an almighty way as well.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 2:21
That is an excellent link. For me - and what that is worth - the new world order did not start with 9/11 but with the withdrawal of Dutch troops from the UN safe haven of Srebrenica. Reaction to this - and the eventual NATO intervention - underlined what had become of “the left”. I was handed a “Stop the bombing” button by my then girlfriend. As Zizek put it some time later, No. More bombing and sooner.
My notions about policy and where things are headed is confused. My convictions have never changed. Somehow the left became synonymous with Stalinist street protest and bone achingly stupid anti-Americanism (the most profoundly reactionary ideology of our age).
I am worried what this new polity is going to look like and I have examples from Moldova to East Timor which I believe make this worry justified. Not to mention the local specifics. I cannot speak for anybody else with the antis for today; certainly some of them will be anti because they are pro-Serb and de facto pro-fascist. They can die. But for fucks sake let’s not throw the bathwater out with the baby (or whatever mangled metaphor is appropriate).
I am going to drink now.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 11:45
It is a long story. The recent history starts with the Second Balkan War of 1912. Serbia invaded and annexed Kosovo with considerable brutality, massacring Albanians in an attempt to shift the ethnic balance. Incidentally, Trotsky was a young war reporter at the time and produced some first hand accounts. Now that victory is reversed. There is a massive amount of partisan mythology being dredged up. I am not overly knowledgeable on Balkan history but I found this good.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 17:38
Marko Attila Hoare on this.
http://greatersurbiton.wordpress.com/2008/02/18/kosova-is-free/
I could do without his lauding of Bush and Blair though.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 17:55
“Marko Attila Hoare on this.”
Christ, did you really link to that transparent sac of smug, bigoted, gloating, racist, dishonest, barefaced hypocricy?
No wonder the fucking comments are closed, an infant could point out the contradictions/self-serving elisions.
This site now belongs in the bigot bin with fucking Lenin’s Juden Raus and Harry’s It’s Dem Muslims Again.
Fuck off bigots.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 17:57
It’s got a bloody massive Albanian flag shoved up on the page covering the text.
Maybe Mr Hoare should get the ‘HP Sauce house moralist’ and his bestest blogger friend in the whole-wide-world, ‘Modernity’ to teach him some basic formatting/resizing skills.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 17:59
That’s all very considered of you Mr Scratch.
Bad day at work or something?
Monday 18 February 2008 at 18:05
He’s probably constipated.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 18:43
“That’s all very considered of you Mr Scratch.
Bad day at work or something?”
Apologies, that was over the top.
I fucking loathe Hoare though, he’s appalling.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 18:44
FROM the outset the American right and their pathetic echo chambers here have been determined to wreck China’s Olympic Games, or at least to diminish them in the way the Moscow Olympics of 1980 were.
Every button is pushed from China’s supposed “occupation” of Tibet (in fact Tibet was always part of the Chinese motherland, and has been rescued from the mists of obscurantism under the demi- God Dalai Lama by the Chinese revolution) through its attitude to circus bears, the Falun Gong and its one-child policy.
George Mosley
Monday 18 February 2008 at 20:01
I don’t give a shit what you think about Hoare or anything else. I linked to him because he’s generally a far more useful source of information than most when it comes to South Eastern Europe. His observation about how few people actually turned out in Serbia to demonstrate is especially worthwhile, and it’s a useful counterpoint to all the hysterics we’ve been getting about how Serbia isn’t going to let go without a fight.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 20:54
Hoare isn’t wrong about everything but he is capable of saying really stupid things
http://tinyurl.com/3c2smo
Monday 18 February 2008 at 21:37
“I don’t give a shit what you think about Hoare or anything else.”
Please yourself you babbling oaf.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 23:05
Kurac.
Monday 18 February 2008 at 23:17
Vittupää need to take some chill pills.
“why can’t we all just get alonnngggg”
Monday 18 February 2008 at 23:31
Anyways — has Conor-I-Used_to-Work-For-AI-Foley spoken on this matter yet?
I won’t know what to think until then.
Tuesday 19 February 2008 at 8:25
[I]n fact Tibet … has been rescued from the mists of obscurantism under the demi-God Dalai Lama by the Chinese revolution.
If I advanced that sort of argument in favour of the continuing occupation of the West Bank and Gaza, do you think the wee orange puffer fish would react with equanimity?
Tuesday 19 February 2008 at 13:41
[Serb fascist based in Belgrade — no — off you go]
Wednesday 20 February 2008 at 11:46
[serbian fash came back — bang — dead in the head]
Wednesday 20 February 2008 at 11:48
[serbian fash came back — bang — dead in the head]